I don't post too often in the DJ section anymore. Everytime I come in here I see threads about controllers and all this next generation gear that, honestly, I'm scared of. The line between what a "DJ" is, is quickly becoming blurred with what a "producer" is.

Can we please just get back to posting stupid threads debating vinyl vs cd? ...your top 10 tracks?

I just want to be able to participate in a thread in the DJ section again. It no longer looks like a DJ section.

Well... it only takes one to start it ;)

The problem is that the times are changing. This just goes to show how big of a waste those CD vs Vinyl arguments were/are b/c CDs simply won't be around much longer. ;)

Lets debate Vinyl vs. Cd...  echo echo echo echo, anybody there ??? 

yeah, those debates are lame, use what you like.

I don't see cds/vinyl totally going away forever and ever but anything can happen, I can't imagine walking into the music store and buying this new improved compact disc thats the size of a floppy.

me the FS/SSL is the best route if you want to try new technology.  no burning cds and big configurations of midi controllers.

posted a top 10 post for you, Chris!  ;D

hah! Thanks!

Why?

Simply because the DJs aren't posting much in it, the producers are!


ditto. As long as it sounds good (quality wise) i don't care. A good mix - imo - is all about the tracks and how they're mixed - not what they're played from.

Hey, Chris, why don't we start a thread of the top 10 top 10 lists?!!! ;)

When did THIS happen!!!

ok, let me re-phrase...

the DJs aren't posting much about DJing - they all seem to want to know about producing.

isn't DJing almost producing these days :)

exactly, the lines have gotten so blurred. sigh.

no, it's sub-DJing now.  OK, not sub-,but pseudo? para-DJing? 

i don't see how sequencing tracks together is being a club DJ.   not that i'm against it per se,but where's the skill? in lining up the WAV forms?

if you're doing what sasha does & remixing on the fly with the raw parts i can see it,but i don't hear of too many people doing that.

guess the 'talent' of beatmatching is obsolete.

Heh heh, DJs became Live PA artists so slowly nobody really noticed... ;)

I would imagine half the people using Ableton aren't using to live PA/remix as much they're using it to be lazy.  :P I mean, I suppose that's okay if you can't beatmatch, but Ableton's generally overkill for DJ'ing imo.

Personally,  I never viewed beatmatching as being a talent,  but rather a skill.  Sure,  some people are better at it,  but being proficient at beatmatching is something anyone can learn to do.


If you're using Ableton properly,  you're not really DJing,  but performing.

End tale,  it's all about knowing how to properly use your equipment.  Would you call a DJ that just mixes between tracks lazy if they don't use the EQs and various effects to enhance their work?

I don't know...This is just a topic I really don't care to dive into.

to be honest, I started out producing and started djing to enhance my production and I realized how much of production skills helps with djing... eq, understanding when and when not to use effects, harmonic mixing, building atmospheres, etc

I pretty much use tracks as instruments that I layer over each other rather than play-crossfade-play-crossfade- etc

And in the same right, djing has enhanced my production skills, because I know what works best in a mixset and what can just clash, and producing makes my djing better...

Here is a quote from David Guetta on the matter.

What’s your advice for at-home DJs hoping to break through with a remix?When I began, it was all about DJing, and so you had to be the best DJ. Now, it’s more about being the best producer, and then you have a chance to DJ, which is I think a little bit strange. Now the market’s global and there’s no way you can succeed if you don’t produce. The only advice I can give as a DJ is to do your own party, even if it’s really small, where you can express yourself.  it’s much easier and more democratic to make music now, but there’s more people so more competition.

See!!!!


Dave, I told you that people are saying this and you said it's not true....I hate to say it but it is becoming true. So what about someone like myself who's tracks don't sound good due to outdated gear and can't afford the gear to make good tracks? yeah, yeah, I know there's free software, but I like to create my own stuff and you just can't create your own samples from software. Sure you can take a royalty free loop disc and edit the samples to sound diffrent, but that's cheating and unoriginal.

I only really want to DJ.

You did???


You use the best that you have and you work, work, work, work and work. Something only sounds as dated as you let it be. Just KNOW ahead of time that the sounds are dated and then try to apply them in a NEW way. That's what graphic design is often times about. In the 80-90's, design heavily borrowed from the 50s, then the 60s, then the 70s...

Come on... outdated gear??? Why is a 303 and a 909 still sought after gear then?



Now you're lying to yourself on this. All I do is create my own samples and loops from software. This is esp true on my tribal stuff. You have a midi keyboard right? All you need is a softsynth.


It's not cheating, but it certainly isn't as original as it could be unless you REALLY tweak the loops out.


Then... DJ. Be the best DJ you can be and don't complain when things change.

I don't know if that's true or not.  Is the opposite also true? I think what's being misread is that people who can do both are obviously talented...and TALENT is what finds success. But is it because they're doing both? I doubt it.
However, I can't say DJing alone is gonna make someone stick out, even if they're really good at it!  :smiley23:

This is a great topic and glad u started it Chris!

I Love Djing too. I also love DJing with ableton and dont agree that lack of beatmatching = lack of talent or creativity. I really think digital djing opens up new avenues for creativity. But at the same time i dont think its about saying completely abandon the decks and everyone must use ableton. Im hoping to use m-audio torq soon! and mix things up a bit more!

I find it interesting that someone like deeflash got more into the dj side as producer. I have started to get more into the producing as a DJ.

Someone asked me about ableton the other day and thought that i didnt even have to choose the tracks the software was doing it all.

I use ableton cause i want to make and create stuff that can be enjoyed! I never play the same set twice as even things in my set are always changing and evolving.

Unless your me. I've been there. I can't really do it well. I suck at making 2 beats match up. I always have been even in band. That's why I'm glad I have a computer.

Well Dave,  it's just because you suck...I mean,  we all realize it.  Acceptance is the first step to recovery.   ;-)

so... there's still hope?

Oh there's hope!  I'll help you learn for just 12 installments on $19.95

Chris,

I think what it really comes down to is do what you do best and have fun doing it..  everytime I start to get discouraged I remember what Proverbs 18:16 says,

A man's gift makes room for him
         And brings him before great men.
                                      -Proverbs 18:16

So when you start to think that you need to do something you might not really feel you're gifted to do in order to succeed, just remember that it's your gift that makes room for you, not being a jack of all trades.  Some of us may be gifted in both aspects, djing and producing, and others may be just djs and others still just producers.  Think of it like, some of us are just ment to play hockey like Wayne Gretsky, others are gifted to be Dione Sanders and play multiple sports...  :-)  Just because Wayne doesn't play 2 sports at once, doesn't make him any worse of an athlete.  And just because Dione plays multiple sports, dones't make him a better athlete!

Poor examples, but you get what I mean, I think.   ;D

Just do what you do best and give your best at it and the gifts that God gave you will shine and make room for you.

-Chris

Yep. http://www.tastyfresh.com/component/option,com_smf/Itemid,97/topic,6587.msg68021#msg68021  ;)

On a side note, I wasn't complaining. I was just reinforcing my thoughts from a few months back. I said:

and you responded with

So, when Matthew said what he said up there, it was another voice saying that basically, in order to suceed as a DJ you have to produce. It's frustrating because not everybody has the gift to produce. I know I don't. I'm done complaining that my tracks aren't good and they don't go anywhere. I let that go months ago. My gripe is this theory that the best way to get your name out there as a DJ is to write tracks. That's it. Nothing more.

I think theres some value in being a producer in getting yr name out but again iys not the only way and it can never be a fixed rule. I think what david g says is just to say how things have swung round. Whats to stop them swinging the other way again?

Dude... your last release was on par with my first release. It was just about as good as Searching for You. You have talent. It just needs to be developed and that will take TIME. I'm just NOW getting to the level where my stuff will sell and where I feel really confident with what I've done. It's been about 9 years now since I started and behind that I have 6 years as a sax player in school. I can't even beatmatch! People like me NEED Ableton. You've got a leg up that I don't since you are a DJ... and a good one at that.


Well... tell that to Doug Theodore (http://www.tastyfresh.com/component/option,com_smf/Itemid,97/topic,7181.0). He's got a different view on that. It also depends on where you really want to go as a DJ.

define "success".  it's a LOOOOOONG road to david guetta success.  you can book tons of gigs locally for yourself,bro.  print up some flyers that are "resumes" and mail them to 500 churches. you'll get gigs...


& this whole outdated equipment excuse is balony.  fatboy slim uses all loops & uses ancient equipment & even pays a guy to program it.
 guys have been signed using that loopmaker thing on PS2...just be creative with what you have.

OK... I hear this so often and NOBODY offers ANY proof. If this were true... ALL of the main producers out there are fakes. It sounds more like wealth envy to me.

hmmmmm, DJ-ing. For me it's just making love to the music. Sorting, crate diggin and listening. I play lots of jazz, so for me this hasn't that much to do with ableton, or whatever software.


DJ section: . . . back in the TF days, something really DJ-section-like: monthly top ten lists! New arrivals, must haves . . .  I think that's somthing DJ-ing brings, collecting & sharing.

surely I produce too. . . but that's untill now, another world. I hope both will come closer together in the future. 

GL

you talkin to me?  ;D   i'm not envious...it was in an old article that he hires an engineer to program the old sequencer he uses.

it's not a big deal, i'm just mentioning that producers get things done. regardless of the circumstances.    they find a way to get stuff out there....


i notice noone addressed the solutions i offered....very typical around here any more...

hey! lets gripe about this same topic 3months from now, shall we!  :smiley8:

THE BEST WAY TO GET YOUR NAME OUT THERE AS A DJ IS TO DJ. PERIOD!!  pound the pavement, make cold calls if you have to, and get the gigs.  i'm talking to myself here as well, because i'm learning this right now. 

I agree, that's what I was kinda saying.  As long as you're doing what you do best and then pushing yourself to do your best and then also doing the behind the scenes work of making calls, pushing mix cds, getting on gigs, etc.  Your gift will shine and make room for you among others.  God doesn't give you a gift without you having to work for it or work your gift even.

wow, this thread really took a wierd turn.

I was just trying to figure out why all of a sudden the dj section is talking about production software such as ableton. That's all.  :laugh:

Oneel!  I'll take two!  does it come with your patented Curl Enhancing Color Swatcher?!  It gives total sheen and control! I'll never go to another Color Swatcher!

B/c some of us DJ with it??  :P

We certainly do!
Regarding creativity. You can do more with two turntables and a mxier then you can with just one turntable. Could grand master flash have started with just one tunrtable?

Graphic design has come on leaps nad bound since designers turned to the computer. They use to do nice stuff without computers, but the designers can now do with computers that was never possible with a scaple and letra set! Again im not arguing ableton above turnatables, but i think we are just at the begiing of new innovation with digital djing!

that and because Dave condensed the boards.  Theres not really a place where producers can discuss studio equipment. There's the Producers and In Progress but most think it as the production technique and preview forum.

Um... Dunamis, that IS the place to discuss those things. this is the place to discuss dj tools and techniques as well as hot tracks, charts and so on.

x2


x2


you can succeed as a DJ....do what you like and put effort into it (that goes for me too.)  I just ended up liking both DJing and producing, I was a DJ before producing, saw the technology and got hooked. But really I've always wanted to write music even before when I just played bass and guitar.  Of course now my DJing skills is rusty but producing the music has given me a better feel for it and has helped when I approach the decks.







yeah, theres really no outdated gear, there are improvements and newer versions but I read Remix and have seen people with old setups.  I've seen people on another forum make good stuff with less, in fact, come over and talk, www.silexz-studios.com/forum.  SOme of those just have FL Studio and use native VSTs and better samples.  Using loops are fine, sometimes you can't edit like you can with a sequencer or sampler but still write music and make it good.  You can find good samples on the internet and then good cds are not that expensive.

Dave is right, for a basic setup all you need is a pc, midi controller and some synths and samples. I told you do what you like and that is DJing.  But if you really want to pursue it, what exactly do you have to write music with?

then please move the RecTable thread to the producers section it got shifted during the condensing and I think there was another.

What RecTable thread??? And... a few out of place threads doesn't mean the system has changed.

when i write tunes on my compy, i like to use the looping function and then pretend that i am djing cuz djs are teh cool.

haha

...I cant remember who it was that asked someone about what or how they wanted to take their DJ Career... I will tell you all now that, my goal as a DJ,.... I really wanted at least one hit track cut to 12' Vinyl Record... That would mean, I would have to produce?
... So be it!