Hi guys,

I've always wanted to be able to do my own tunes however never sure what software is best to use, or any plugins I should have.

Also what kit would you need alongside. I am able to get hold of midi Keyboard, and if i wanted lyrics a sure SM58 mic.

I think it's an area many people are interested in. Making your own music is so satisfying from my minimal experience.

Thanks for any advice

i would recommend ableton live 7 and kore 2 on a pc with at least 3 gb ram.  on the cheap, hit up fl studio or cakewalk kinetic 2 and the free kore player, with an m-audio interface.  novation remote sl keyboards are the bomb, or get an edirol with a good software bundle.
hope this helps.
beyond cheap, you can get free daws such as acid xpress, crystal audio engine, trackax for pc, and reaper.  www.freemusicsoftware.org has a bunch of goodies, and there are plenteous free virtual instruments out there.

I just picked up Logic 8 and it is the BOMB! I used Logic 7 previously and am familiar with Reason and Ableton as well. Right now I am a little overwhelmed with the 8, but the potential is amazing! My opinion has always been to go for the gusto when you purchase something like this because in the long run you will probably be happy that you did (rather than upgrading to another platform and having to learn something new in a year or 2) I have friends that do everything in Ableton and they love it too, but from the research I have done it seems Logic has the most to offer. If you have a midi controller and a mic you will no doubt be able to produce some goodness right from the get go, without any plug ins, etc If you have a Mac you can start your projects in Garage Band, which is a little more user friendly, and then import them into Logic if you like for finishing the project.

my 2 cents...
I'd like to hear what everyone else on this board thinks.

ableton all the way!

and build up form there

This sounds like production thread. Can it be moved, dear moderators?

Yea sorry, anyway of moving it?

Own a Macbook Pro, so do have garageband. Although I know from using reason there was a lot more sounds and manipulation.

Have tried ableton but not found it that easy to pick up. But only used demos.

keep going it will be worth it!

Its easier than you will think! Just different to others

Try using it in live mode! Get some clips warped and try jamming live!

I find it an amazing way to put idea s together

fl studio as a sequencer and you have to have "Nexus!!!" Incredible plugin and really sounds great for not putting holes in your pocket  8)

Yes, garage band is really not much but loops. if you are looking for more sounds, synths, manipulation, etc I still think that you can not go wrong with Logic. It will take some time to learn, but the potential is unlike any other program I have ever experimented with. Very happy with my investment

I totally vote for Logic Pro 8.  So much better than 7!

Since you own a MAC already Logic 8 is the way to go.  I used Reason for years, Digital Performer and Logic 8 is an awesome platform.  It has everything you need already to make quality productions, and its fastly becoming an industry standard for many producers out there.  Ableton is a cool program, but I think its secondary to Logics ability, I know lots of guys who use both, but usually sync it up to Logic 8. 

I'll have to agree with Responsible T,
Except for the fact that he's on a PC.
Ableton Live is the app that we're praising
warping and sound synced effects are amazing.
Kore as librarian can't be beat
and one step better is adding Komplete.
Novation's astounding I can't wait to try it,
A few more months and I think I will buy it.
And speaking of vocals, to make them shine
complete pitch perfection is from Melodyne.

Logic is wonderful,
but right now I'm trying to get my hands on Cubase.
I think I've found a way to do it (I know it works at least for americans ~ they determine stuff based on where you live).

(a) get your hands on cubase le (friends with m-audio hardware should have it)
(b) go to http://www.steinberg.net/1359_1.html
(c) follow the steps and buy the upgrade from le.

http://www.steinbergupgrades.com/
For Cubase Studio 4 the upgrade is only $200, for Cubase 4 it's a mere $400.
The original prices (MSRP), respectively, are $520 and $1040.

I hope someone who reads this will be able to save boat loads of money.

i like cubase studio 4!
liked reason as wel... never worked with logic. but software doesn't say everything!
skills, tallent and willpower!!! and blessings from God!

I might add that when you are looking around at set ups, you may want to check out what a few of your favorite producers are using.

Reason is tedious if you don't have a MIDI keyboard.  One thing I like about FL Studio is that you can use your computer keyboard as an instrument instead of a MIDI (but obviously a real MIDI is better if you have one).  It's good for those of us who haven't yet invested in a MIDI keyboard (which, I heard about a great deal across town and might be buying one today).  Those are the only two I've really gotten to know at this point.  From what I've heard others saying, Ableton & Logic are great, but I can't testify.  I know the DJ from Desperation Band uses Ableton--only mention it because I like what I hear from him.

Garageband, Logic, FL, and Ableton can do the keyboard midi thing.

I wouldn't say that anyone needs a midi controller, but everyone wants one. It does make some things faster, like adjusting your vst synth settings and quickly hearing what the result is.


If it's too easy right off the bat then a red flag goes up for me. Any good program is going to be slightly difficult at first, but when you get the hang of it you won't even remember that difficulty down the road. ...That is with any current software because old software is going to be intrinsically difficult to use because of the lack of technology.

really not keen on garageband, i can see it bein good for recordin instruments an that.. but just can't seem to make the music I want,

i am lucky to have a midi controller anyway.

Yea understand the learnin curve of it. Spose i jus need to wait till i got some time an patience to sit down and get round it all. Never bothered too much with live as you can not save in demo's so unless i get a copy of it or sumit i can not spend much time on it unless i leave it runnin.

Is logic in same style as cubase rather than being like reason?

Logic is definitely more like Cubase than reason.
The only thing I don't like about Logic is that the audio engine overloads when you change from speakers to headphones in the middle of a song ~ it's really not a big deal though. I'm not sure about Logic's vst support, but it accepts other kinds of plugins, like AU.

I chose Cubase because Steinberg invented VST and ASIO ~ so Cubase must be amazing because of those two things if nothing else. I expect Cubase to come in the mail in 2 days ~ I just ordered it.

Curious, but what are you talking about switchin from speakers to headphones?  How does that overlaod the audio engine, it shouldn't even be connected that way.  My headphones are connected to my interface, if I don't want my speakers on I turn them off.  Sounds like you are doing something much different than I...

If I have headphones connected to the headphone jack (audio out) on my macbook pro, then I decide I want to hear it through speakers and switch it out, then Logic says something about an audio engine overload. The same thing happens if I suddenly go into a complex part of a song.

I click ok, then press play again and it's fine.

Cubase 4 Rockzz!! 8) It's very stabel and i've never had any problems with it ;)

But now i'm curious.... what do u use for mastering??

If you meant me, I still don't know a whole lot about mastering. I finally got Cubase in the mail like an hour ago, I suppose I'll use it to master.

I have a glancing idea about what mastering is, but tell me a bit more in depth, what is mastering?

Try linking all tracks together by clicking the little thing that looks like a chain in the upper left hand corner. That should do the trick. I used to run into this issue a lot in Logic 7, but did some research and found out that was my problem because there was too much trying to play in real time. I rarely run into this issue in Logic 8. You are right, this is such a minor issue though and if you were going to use Logic to perform live you would be using MainStage anyways and wouldn't have this problem. I picked up Logic 8 about a month ago and am more than happy with my investment. The potential of the program is unbelievable! I don't see myself needing much (if any) for plug ins and the mastering is top notch. I really can't comment on Cubase because I have never owned it 

Generally you would have an interface that has outs on it for your speakers, and your headphones work at the same time.  Switching outs while things are runnin isnt good for any program. 

An engineer

x2

Well mastering is a bit of an art, and generally requires some experience, the right tools, and a great room.  If you are putting out a legit project I would always pay to have an engineer master it, especially if you have only been producing for a few years.  Lots of people self master, and you can become OK at it, but I have found that a real mastering engineer can get material sounding better.  I have boughten a few tools in the past few years, where I am actually thinking of going down that road soon.  ITs bascially become a loudness war for the uneducated, but I guess its about managing dynamics and eq in a way that translates and brings out the elements of the music.  Mastering will not fix a bad mix, but can take a great one to a whole new level.  I would really advise mastering some material on your own, and then sending a unmastered file to an engineer, so you can first hand hear the difference of a pro.  I've done it multiple times.  I've worked with Neil Kolo of fade records, A local guy (who I still use), and a mastering house in Berlin, they are all just a bit different, and have different strengths, so its a lot more than just throwing on a limiter and such in your host software.  .02

What's the best way to transfer music to someone to be mastered? Can you just export to a WAV and then they do the rest with EQs, or do they need access to the "rig" to be able to more finely tune the levels of the different elements?

Well I'm not exactly sure what you mean here by accessing the rig, but usually an ME will have everything he needs in his studio to get the job done.  If you are looking for the certain sound of a piece of gear or analog compression etc you may pick one over the other.
Yeah you can just export a stereo 24bit WAV of your track if you would like.  Some people do DAT, but I think most people today do files now.  A few places will even have an FTP etc for you to work with. 

OK, let me clarify more then. Let's say I make all my music in Reason. Once I've got tracks done and ready to be mastered, in what format would I need to transfer them to the engineer? Like could I assume the engineer also has Reason, and so just give them a Reason file with all the samples, patches. Or would it be best to export the Wav and send that. Or what if I'm old school and all I have is a rack of hardware.

The root question was how deep into the instrumentation will different engineers like to play? Are we talking some EQing over the finished track, or they going to want to put compression in places I might not have, per instrument, etc.

I appreciate there may be no concise answer to this, and maybe it's just negotiated with each engineer.

A mastering engineer will want a mixed down File wav or aiff usually preferably at 24 bit 48 khz however if you only work at 16 bit 44khz then that is fine basically the mastering engineer will probably tell you what formats he/she accepts and what format mp3 wav etc you want the output dependant on what you want the output for. If you are going to produce 12's from it it is done differently so they would need to know this also.

The mastering engineer may refer the project back to you if there is a major problem in the mixdown that they cant deal with for you to redo.

A mix engineer some one who is going to produce a mixdown of your track would want as much as possible ie the reason file or individually bounced tracks. they would produce the mixdown which would then go to the mastering engineer.

I hope this clarifies what different peoples roles are and what they need to get the job done. Look up an online mastering service and see what they say they accept.

If you want a mix engineer you could pm me.

MrH summed a bit of this up, but basically a mastering engineer works with finished material.  You'll pay a whole lot more for someone to mix your work, and master it.  If you want someone to mix your work, then you can print audio stems of all your parts.  I would want to work in Logic anyway, most people have a host application they like to use.  As long as you send them a standard format they can read like WAV or AIFF etc everything is good.  Also I would like to note that most people can agree that unless you are doubleing sample rates from 44.1 to 88.2 etc that 44.1 is plenty to send in for mastering, and may not be of any help, but defo go 24bit.  IMO.

Thanks guys, that's great.

One thing to add, never use a limiter before going to mastering.  If you aren't completely sure about proper compression best to leave the master buss un processed for the ME.